Discussió:Llista d'invents i descobriments catalans

Aixó de possar NINCO es una mica bèstia. Ninco es una derivada de Scalextric, que tampoc va inventar res, doncs treballava sota llicencia SuperSlot. (empresa anglesa). --XPOferens què vols dir-me? 14:33, 3 juny 2010 (CEST)

Catalan invents and discoveries

Sorry for my english, but I don't write catalan. This list contains so many errors and incoherencies that I do not know where to start. Maybe the main problem is that the title of this article is misleading the reader and that would explain all the confusion.

• Allioli: Some reference on the fact that this is a catalan invent or discovery should be provided. For coherency, the origen seccion of the alliolli page should be updated too then.
• Cava: Some coherency should be done with the Cava page. It is stated that the Cava is obtained using the méthode Champenoise with local white wine. It is thus hard to define the Cava as an invent or a discovery. A better place could be in a list of "Catalan products" maybe ?
• Chupa chups: A company is NOT a discovery or an invent. I guess you meant the product of this company with the same name.
• Ensaïmada: Some reference on the fact that this is a catalan invent should be provided.
• Escalivada Idem. (In a general way, I have some difficulties in considering a recipe as an invent. But that's a personal thought.)
• Pa amb tomàquet: If I refer to Pa amb tomàquet it is not clear that the origin is catalan. Some reference should be provided.
• Panellets. Idem.
• Volta catalana:Is this really a catalan invent ? Give some reference and update Volta catalana in this case.
• Vara de Jacob: Apparently, there is discussion on the fact that this is a catalan invent. See Vara de Jacob.
• Telescopi: This is not clear. There is one article that suggest that it might be Joan Roget that discovered the telescope. But the hypothesis has not been yet validated by peer-reviewed articles. I would take some precautions on this one.
• Teoria de la neurona: That's a tough one. Santiago Ramón y Cajal is aragones. The discovery was made one year after he arrived in Barcelona. Is that enough to qualify this invent as catalan ?
• Telègraf elèctric: The entry Telègraf elèctric should be edited accordingly for coherency.
• Pal de fregar: The official inventor of the Pal de fregar is Manuel Jalón Corominas from "la Riojà" as stated by a [decision]. Which disqualifies the "pal de fregar" as a catalan invent.
• Ninco: Again, a company is NOT an invent or a discovery.
• Avarques menorquines: It is not because something is traditional in a place that it has been invented in this place. Could you give references ?
• Espardenyes amb betes: Idem.
• Farga catalana, Trompa d'aigua, Martinet (farga), etc... Again, it is not because something has catalan in the name that it means it has been discovered in Catalunya. From the [Wikipedia, it appears that the "Farga catalana" was used in very different places. And that the most characteristic element from the "Farga catalana" is the "Trompa d'aigua" which come from Italy. Serious references on the fact that the "farga catalana" and "trompa d'aigua" should be provided.
• Maquina de vapor: I can cite you several "Maquinas de vapor" that were invented nearly two centuries before 1805 and that are not catalan. If you want to start a new war with France, you could maybe cite Blasco de Garay. He was a toledano but the possible experiment was located in... Barcelona !!! Yeepeee !!!
• Vacuna del còlera: May be you should put a link to the page of Jaume_Ferran_i_Clua.
• Xeringa d'un sol ús: Reference ? I've found Manuel Jalón Corominas but with no valid references. And Manuel Jalón Corominas was a riojan.
• Inoxcrom: A company is NOT an invent.
• Bonet: Is that an invent or a discovery ? Or an engineering work ?
• Bultaco, etc...: All companies should go to another list "Catalan companies". They do not have their place in this list.

Overall conclusion

I find the idea of this list quite interesting but some serious work needs to be done. A lot of references are missing, some contradicts articles in the same wiki (!), some do not relate to "invents i descobriments", and some are not "catalans". For the moment it looks more like chaos than anything and should be reorganized. Some other questions to be discussed :

• Can culinar recipes be considered as invents or discoveries ?
• Can companies be considered as invents or discoveries ???
• Do engineering work or technological development be considered as invents or discoveries ?
• What is considered catalan ? The inventor, the location of the invention, the location of the first experiment ? Do we use the definition catalan as defined by the IEC or the political condition ? For instance is a Valencian considered a Catalan (and thus the paella should have been in this list too) or not (and thus some items should be removed from this list) ? —el comentari anterior sense signar és fet per 90.9.239.21 (disc. • contr.) 01:23, 14 nov 2013 (CET)

Bones reflexions i puntualitzacions. De moment, agrupo les empreses i sol·licito referències per als punts que demanes. El principal contribuent, Catalaalatac, suposo que s'hi podrà passar per donar el seu punt de vista. --Panotxa (disc.) 05:56, 14 nov 2013 (CET)

El que s'ha pogut, s'ha referenciat, la resta, esborrat. --Panotxa (disc.) 08:52, 23 març 2014 (CET)

Encara queda molt per referenciar...